I read quite a few times on the forum the opinion that when playing a fish that you can feel the fish better with bamboo than with graphite. I'm not a
physicist but from my experience I'm pretty sure the opposite is true. I think that bamboo by it's physical properties dampens vibration more than
graphite. I'm pretty sure that the biggest limiting factor affecting the feel of the fish is the fly line. I remember from my spin fishing days in the
80's and 90's the difference in feel when using monofiliment compared to the newer spun fiber lines like Firewire. Mono stretches a lot and Firewire
almost none. With Firewire, the tiniest nibble or bump was noticeable. I haven't used true silk fly line a lot but it seemed to stretch less than the
plastic lines and if so, IMO, it may have a larger effect on feel than using either bamboo or graphite. Agree or disagree?
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The Feel of Fighting a Fish -- Bamboo vs. Graphite
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 tiptop |
The Feel of Fighting a Fish -- Bamboo vs. Graphite |
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Posts: 415 12/05/2008 10:33 |
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Boonut |
#1 | |||
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Posts: 353 12/05/2008 12:12 |
I have to agree. A cane rod may protest small tippets better, and it feels better casting, but I feel what the fish is doing more on graphite.
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oldtrout |
#2 | |||
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Posts: 80 12/05/2008 12:37 |
I am incapable of expressing in words the "feel" of a bamboo rod when I have I have a fish on. The rods seems to come "alive."
The feeling is ineffable for a dolt like me to convey, but it's that feeling more than anything that's made me a bamboo rod addict. |
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riverfloggin |
#3 | |||
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Posts: 70 12/05/2008 12:39 |
I definitely "feel" the fish better with bamboo. I agree that bamboo should dampen the stress put on by the fish more than graphite, but for me the
deeper flex of bamboo imparts better feel. Also (and I'm not really sure about this) there might be something about the way bamboo transmits sensations
from the fish when it has a good bend in it; I don't know that bamboo always dampens vibrations more than graphite, there may be some changes in those
characteristics as stress is added.
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bulldog1935 |
#4 | |||
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Posts: 6455 12/05/2008 15:13 Bulldog1935 |
I can tell you from fishing by feel 95% of the time that cane and glass are many times superior for feel than graphite.
Graphite is designed with dampening built into it - if it wasn't, it would be such a spring that it would never stop vibrating. If you read their own ad copy they tout dampening as a characteristic they've engineered into the rod. But all that aside - like I said, I fish by feel 95% of the time. When people have asked me to try their fast rods, instead of counting the fish I caught, I was counting the fish I missed because the rod dampened out the earliest feel of fish and all I was able to feel was the fish's rejection. Graphite is the lightest, fastest, farthest-casting tool you can bring to the gunfight, but if you need to feel fish to catch them, fish cane or glass.
the rods are never obsolete - the marketing is.
Last Edited By: bulldog1935 12/05/2008 15:18.
Edited 2 times.
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WatercolorMan |
#5 | |||
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Posts: 1157 12/05/2008 15:49 |
I think there are many factors involved regarding the "feel" of a fighting fish or take or even a bump. First the long heavy rods dampen the feel
more that the small rods. So If its the smaller line wt. rod were talking about I can share my experience there. I owned one Graphite rod that I bought around
1985 or so, I was the Orvis One Weight. It was the first one weight graphite fly rod and I had to give it a try. The rod was 7 1/2' long and 1 3/8oz it was
precise and delicate and could land a fish over 20" long. I live out West and when the wind started blowing in the afternoon you put it away. It was one
of the few rods that bent like my bamboo rods when landing fish, but I never liked to cast it much unless I went up to the TT 3/4 line and then I could feel it
load and deal with some wind. In the end I the bamboo rods were what I wanted to fish and the One Weight ended up in my son's truck. That was 20 years ago
and I saw it still there this summer.
I don't think its the bamboo in and of itself that dampens the vibrations more or less than graphite. If you don't factor in the taper then the question becomes kind of general. If the rod has a swell in the butt section you effect the feel by choice. I think the amount of cork is one of the the biggest factor in the equation. I have noticed the smaller thinner grips transmit more feeling to the hand. Some tapers make a big difference by the rise of the taper as well. The feel of my 8' 3/4 wt rod feels way different than my 8' 7wt Orvis, big difference in the mass has an effect on the feel. Look at how many small cork grips are on old Leonard fly rods. I have a 9' Fairy with a 5" grip. Bamboo without cork gives the most feel just ask Jeff Hatton what he thinks about the subject. I may not be the best guy to cover this subject because I didn't make the transition from Graphite to Boo like some others have. I started with bamboo skiped the Graphite days all together. I did land a few fish this summer on my sons Sage 9'RPL 3wt. and wasn't that thrilled by how it felt handling the fish. It was just to unfeeling for me enjoy like I do with bamboo, not my taste in rods. Alan |
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wb4tjh |
#6 | |||
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Posts: 400 12/05/2008 15:59 |
I like the feel of cane because it suits a more laid-back type of personality, I think. When your sole purpose in flyfishing is to catch as many fish as
possible in the least amount of time, then fast graphite probably suits you better. But the older I get...62 now...the more at ease I take life and the slower
I am to anger and more apt to roll with life's little waves. I love to meander my way up or down a stream, casting easily to this spot or that spot, never
in a hurry. Bamboo rods just seem to go with that style of fishing. I get to see a lot of stream unhurried, and hopefully, take a few fish in the process. A
good, bamboo rod just fits into that low tech scenario better than the latest techno-gizmo rod. I can feel my cast and know where the fly is going by instinct.
I like good glass rods for the same reason. The few graphite stream rods I do own tend to be the older, slower, full flexing Orvis rods of some years ago. My
one exception is in saltwater: there I tend to use a faster, longer, heavier line weight, graphite rod. The need for long, sometimes quick, accurate casts
often dictates a different technique with heavier, weighted flies. But even there, I have learned how to stroll among the mangroves, exploring like I do on the
stream. When you hunt saltwater fish by sight, you take in all your surroundings; the frenzy of birds, a
 of sunlit silver, a shadow against a sand
bottom, the sight of a tailing fish, or the sudden panic of exploding bait fish. I know a lot of people fish bamboo in saltwater, but I don't have a bamboo
rod that I feel is totally suitable. Maybe down the road I will find one. Maybe, my 8014 Dickerson taper might be worth trying.
Fine flyrods can be made from different materials, but bamboo is the Benchmark against which all the rest are compared......
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Boonut |
#7 | |||
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Posts: 354 12/05/2008 19:10 |
You don't need to compare to fast graphite rods. If you're going to compare, use a softer graphite to compare. I've owned graphite rods that had
more of a bend with a fish on than some cane rods. Graphite doesn't have to be fast.
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oysterbamboo |
a question of definition... | #8 | ||
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Posts: 257 12/05/2008 19:36 |
I think, like all good debates, that there are actually two different ideas being discussed. Those who rave about the "feel" of bamboo when playing
a fish aren't usually describing the ability to feel the fish directly. A steel pipe connected to a strand of barbed wire would actually transfer more
feel than any type of fly rod, so of course a stiffer graphite gives more direct feeling of the fish (notice how I slipped in that graphite dis?
 ). The "feel" that folks rave about is the way the rod flexes, bends,
and pulses under the slightest tug. It's the same way that it's more fun to play a 10" trout on a 3wt. than on an 8wt. no matter the material.
This "feel" would explain why so many graphite guys are going to the new ultra lightweight rods like the 0wt, 00wt, 000wt, or whatever. The
"feel" of playing a fish on bamboo is what we all love.
Bill O. www.oysterbamboo.com |
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Boonut |
#9 | |||
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Posts: 355 12/05/2008 21:28 |
Bill.................That comes back to the bend of the rod, and not feeling the fish. I have to say again. Some graphite rods bend just as much, or more
depending on the bamboo.
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tiptop |
#10 | |||
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Posts: 416 12/05/2008 23:25 |
Bill -- Interesting to divide the "feel" into two components and I do think that's true enough although we experience the fight as a whole. My
original question was referring just to the vibrations portion not so much the bending and dipping of the rod. I do agree that both components are enhanced
with a smaller rod (or bigger fish!) -- I guess that's pretty obvious. And whether graphite or bamboo, the faster the rod the more vibrations felt and
conversely, the slower the rod, the more bending and more dampening of vibrations. I guess this is the bamboo equivalent of navel-gazing but fun to think
about when it's 15 degrees out.
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oysterbamboo |
#11 | |||
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Posts: 258 12/06/2008 00:17 |
Boonut, I agree completely. Some graphites are very full flexing and some bamboo rods are very stiff. I wasn't trying to refute your statement, just
responding to a quick read-through of everyones comments as a whole.
tiptop, I also agree with your original post. Just pointing out the duality of the post with its title "the feel of fighting a fish" and the fact you took issue with, as stated in your first line, the opinion that "you can feel the fish better". I noticed that in the followup posts folks ran off in both directions which tends to lead to strange places. For the record I prefer the feel of bamboo, but think any lighter, stiffer, and less stretchy material transmits a more direct feeling of what the fish is doing. I'm in it for the fun and a fish on bamboo transmits the biggest smile to my face every time. I can feel that through and through! Bill O. www.oysterbamboo.com
Last Edited By: oysterbamboo 12/06/2008 01:21.
Edited 1 time.
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Gnome |
#12 | |||
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Posts: 1809 12/08/2008 10:34 King of the Gnomes |
And to stir the pot;
to feel what your rod is truly doing you need to remove the layer of mother natures finest dampening agent called cork which takes away feel due to its tetrakaidecahedral cellular structure (thirteen sided closed cell that compresses and expands thus removing vibration/feel) 5 plus years now of fishing rods with no cork and I will never go back to it. Mortised griped rods have a feel that is unique and it is from the removal of the cork. gnome |
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Zenkoanhead |
#13 | |||
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Posts: 1410 12/08/2008 19:28 |
I think there is a consensus that several variables are involved. I would analogize the situation to a radio. Crank it up too high and it is not just louder,
it becomes just so much noise. Whatever the trade offs are, I generally like bamboo better. Don
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bobbeegee |
tetrakaidecahedral | #14 | ||
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Posts: 2164 12/08/2008 19:37 |
Gnome, That is one great word.
I've got to try and work that in to a conversation at a couple of Christmas parties this season! Like..........."were you aware the cork from that wine bottle is tetrakaidecahedral"!! I can see the recent divorcees swoon!!  
Bob
Go Heels!!!
Last Edited By: bobbeegee 12/08/2008 19:42.
Edited 2 times.
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thousandstar |
#15 | |||
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Posts: 113 12/08/2008 20:09 |
I get so excited when I get a fish on that I don't pay any attention to the small details of feel. For me the benefit of bamboo comes in the casting.
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Boonut |
#16 | |||
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Posts: 358 12/08/2008 21:33 |
thousandstar wrote: I agree completely. That's what I love about cane too. |
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sharps4590 |
#17 | |||
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Posts: 52 12/08/2008 22:00 |
Welp, I prefer bamboo. I don't have a clue as to the physics involved or the dampening or the
tetracycline.....er....uhhh....tetrahydraheaded.......whatever that 13 sided thingamabob word was.....I like bamboo because it's OLDer than glass or
graphite and the way it was done in 1910....and earlier! Same reason I prefer flintlocks and longbows!
Vic |
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mattcliff |
#18 | |||
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Posts: 22 12/08/2008 22:43 |
Been so long since I fished a graphite rod, I honestly don't remember whether they seemed to fight fish better. I do remember the fast actions of the
graphites I was fishing were not too kind to fine tippets. But that could just be the action. But even a "fast" bamboo rod cushions a tippet pretty
well in my experience, so I guess one could count that as an advantage over graphite.
One thing I did notice when I started fishing bamboo rods was that I had to adjust my timing on the strike. Seems like I have to be quicker to set the hook than with graphite. I'd be curious to know if anyone else has noticed this. |
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Gnome |
#19 | |||
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Posts: 1812 12/09/2008 10:34 King of the Gnomes |
bobbeegee,
It is a tough one to use in mixed company ;-) and invariably it does raise eyebrows and can be the cause of strange looks for sure!!! Jeff |
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thegubster |
I tried looking it up... | #20 | ||
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Posts: 1480 12/09/2008 10:47 |
bobbeegee wrote: ..and my 'puter crashed!
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