Hello and thoughts on this hardy perfect

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steel2afly	Hello and thoughts on this hardy perfect		Lead	[-]
Posts: 3 10/06/2008 23:15	Tags : None Hello all. As it goes "long time lurker" only seldom post. Quick intro. My name is Kevin and I live in a small northern california coastal town. My username should tell you my main interest! Got the classic reel bug a couple of years ago and have to thank all the experts on these pages for all the info and help they have given me, and probably lots of money saved also! Havent really had anything to offer til now. So I picked this reel up last week. Its a Hardy perfect 3 7/8". Ive been trying to educate myself on hardys and have been doing alot of searching to find out more info on this particular reel. So heres what Ive come up with and feel free to correct me and add any info PLEASE! It has a 1912 check, strap over tension screw, white ivorine? handle, nickle silver agate line guard( which has two cracks, bummer) and has hardys pat written on it, Has circular hardys alnwick patent logo on winding plate. The spool has 4 cusps and a locking nut. All parts are marked with a number 3, Now heres where I have a couple of questions. The inside of the winding plate is marked 3 P. The inside of the cage has the marks 3 and below that 7 6989. The 3 and the 7 appear to be slightly smaller case letters than the 6989. The 3s on all parts are matching. Now the foot. Its a smooth brass foot aproximatly 3 3/16' long held in by four screws. Its not dovetailed in and has a letter J stamped on on the base of the foot on the spool side. Lots of stamps on this one! So any ideas on the J or other numbers. Doing my research it seams as though the reel seems to be original parts wise? The J on the foot is kinda throwing me off though. The reel works GREAT! The tension screw was froze up but was able to get it going again no problem, the cracks in the agate are kind of a bummer but oh well. Did a very light cleaning following bulldogs vinegar bath method, allowed it to air dry, gave it a wipe down with a silicone free guncloth and that is the extent of my cleaning. Im pretty happy with this reel and think I may have lucked into a nice one here. So what do ya think? Hope these pictures work! Thanks in advance for any help and info anyone can give me. Kevin
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Sparquero		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 130 10/07/2008 00:20	Very nice reel, excellent and hard to find check & it cleaned up real nice! Letters & numbers are probably only a way for the reel maker to keep track of the parts. Other than the initials of the senior reel makers which are identified on Hardy's website, Hardy had a reputation in those days of hiring apprentices and then letting them go just when they are finished their indentureship and will have to be paid more money. I believe there was not much consistency with numbering amongst the apprentices, many probably stamped the reel parts with whatever came to mind and Hardy did not seem to care as long as the finished product upheld the standard. Too bad about the agate, they are available for a price and could be replaced by a couple of reel repair people mentioned on this board, although if the cracks cannot be felt with a Q-tip and do not affect the fly line then I would just fish it as is. That reel will probably last another 100 years. Great size for steelhead!
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WatercolorMan		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1058 10/07/2008 04:29	Welcome Kevin You are off to a great start, perfect reels are so fun. Do you have a rod to put it on yet ? Alan
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bulldog1935		#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6174 10/07/2008 09:33 Bulldog1935	that is about as nice as they get, but I guess the foot is bent, which is tough on brass of that heavy section - is it riveted or held on with screws? the rods are never obsolete - the marketing is.
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steel2afly		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4 10/07/2008 10:01	Thanks guys. Perhaps it was late in the day and the apprentices had a nip or two of scotch a bit early and got carried away with the stamps! Alan Ive got a new Meiser on the way and had him make it with a seat that would accomadate larger reel feet. And I will be building up a couple of new rods also with larger seats. Not bamboo however, one addiction at a time at this point. Bulldog Looking closer at the foot it is slightly bent! But nowwhere near what the closeup picture makes it look, I think there is some macro zoom distortion going on in that picture. It is held on with four screws. I dont think its bent enough to be a problem getting it on a rod. Do I sense a possible solution brewing in your minid Bulldog with that question?? Thanks again guys. Kevin
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MFRS		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 71 10/08/2008 07:11	This check is actually called the "New Patent Compensating Check" and I suspect the 76989 is its Patent #, the 7 and 8 seem to be a smaller font so I think the different punch was sometimes mistakedly used; the numbers were important for the maker and the patent. I have a 1921 Perfect stamped "Hardy's Patent 24245" on check side. Very nice reel steel2afly, I recently had an alloy hardy on brackish water and I had cleaned it earlier and did not put a new protectant on it. I fished it and it started chalking up so I cleaned it, let it dry and applied liquid wax to it, buffed it and it is well protected from the environment now. The reel foot sometimes has a patent # stamped on it so the J may contribute to an earlier reel size identification, just my guess but I found that Hardy when makers stamped something on a reel it always led to a reason. MFRS
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turtledoc		#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2128 10/08/2008 09:29 Moderator	Steel2afly - The 1912 check Perfects with grey agate are my favorite perfects, and yours is a GREAT example....it's got eveything going for it....very nice condition, but not too nice to use on occasion . Regarding the internal numbering, I've owned a few and seen many circa 1910-15 Hardy Perfect and St George reels with these 5 or 6 digit numbers and have never seen one with the same number, I don't know with any certainty what they mean though, if anything. It isn't the check patent though (that wasn't a bad guess MFRS), but the patent 24245 that is later stamped on Hardy reels was the patent for the "New Compensating Check" applied for in October 1910 and first seen in the original St George and Perfects with checks like yours (usually referred to as the "1912 check"). A great reel that should sing a beautiful reel when a hot steelie is on the other end of the line Thanks for sharing the pics ! Mark B Recent founder of the "Mark's Sanctuary for Wayward Bogdan Reels", a place where any Bogdan reel that shows up on the doorstep will NOT be discriminated against based on its color, age, size, or winding persuasion, and WILL be provided a safe and happy home for the rest of my days.
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bow river		#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 744 10/08/2008 09:46	for a older hardy reel , i think you got the reel with the nicest check , this is a reel you can use and feel good for it's been used and i'd bet it's caught some fine fish in it's day , the foot is a easy fix , i have done lots , you see that on alot of older reels , the agate is not a bummer my friend , no big deal as you can pick up a new one and have it installed for around $50 , me i'd put a nice dark red one in it , i have a thing for red agates for such a fine reel it needs you to fish it and enjoy it and mostly give it some TLC , well done on such a fine reel , i always like the writeing around the screw for the spool on these older hardy's , you also have a nice handle , your +++ are way above the few things that need to be done to the reel Richard Check out my web site for vintage reels & rods , guided float trips on canada's # 1 best trout river http://bowriveradventures.googlepages.com/home
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steel2afly		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6 10/08/2008 10:33	Thanks for all the added information gentleman. As said Ive mostly been a lurker for a while but with this reel I thought I just might have something worth sharing. Im definatly very happy to have obtained this reel. And as many have suggested it will certainly be put to use out on the river. While it does have its negatives for me the positives are far greater. I couldnt be happier. For now Im going to leave it as is, put her on a rod and get to some fishing! The check certainly does have a sweet sound to it and should definatly sing and I look forward to hearing its song. Thanks to all who post on this forum, the knowledge gained here was a great help in the purchase and history of this reel. Being the new blind squirrel in the woods I think I found my first acorn! Hopefully it wont be the last. Good fishing to all. Kevin
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FWdB		#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 131 10/08/2008 15:17	Very nice reel Kevin! I love those early Pefects, but I must warn you that most likely many more acorns will follow as a result of frequently visiting this particular section of the forum. Been there, done that... Wilfred de Bruijn The Lowlands Of Holland
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MFRS		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 163 12/29/2008 20:29	steel2afly wrote: Hello all. As it goes "long time lurker" only seldom post. Quick intro. My name is Kevin and I live in a small northern california coastal town. My username should tell you my main interest! Got the classic reel bug a couple of years ago and have to thank all the experts on these pages for all the info and help they have given me, and probably lots of money saved also! Havent really had anything to offer til now. So I picked this reel up last week. Its a Hardy perfect 3 7/8". Ive been trying to educate myself on hardys and have been doing alot of searching to find out more info on this particular reel. So heres what Ive come up with and feel free to correct me and add any info PLEASE! It has a 1912 check, strap over tension screw, white ivorine? handle, nickle silver agate line guard( which has two cracks, bummer) and has hardys pat written on it, Has circular hardys alnwick patent logo on winding plate. The spool has 4 cusps and a locking nut. All parts are marked with a number 3, Now heres where I have a couple of questions. The inside of the winding plate is marked 3 P. The inside of the cage has the marks 3 and below that 7 6989. The 3 and the 7 appear to be slightly smaller case letters than the 6989. The 3s on all parts are matching. Now the foot. Its a smooth brass foot aproximatly 3 3/16' long held in by four screws. Its not dovetailed in and has a letter J stamped on on the base of the foot on the spool side. Lots of stamps on this one! So any ideas on the J or other numbers. Doing my research it seams as though the reel seems to be original parts wise? The J on the foot is kinda throwing me off though. The reel works GREAT! The tension screw was froze up but was able to get it going again no problem, the cracks in the agate are kind of a bummer but oh well. Did a very light cleaning following bulldogs vinegar bath method, allowed it to air dry, gave it a wipe down with a silicone free guncloth and that is the extent of my cleaning. Im pretty happy with this reel and think I may have lucked into a nice one here. So what do ya think? Hope these pictures work! Thanks in advance for any help and info anyone can give me. Kevin I had to resurrect this thread as I came upon new information that I feel explains the numbers stamped on this reel, I know steel2afly and others who are owners of these classic reels will benefit and appreciate their classics , probably, even more. I found that some, if not all, Hardy reels were registered based on the name of the reel. For example, some provenance from Hardy Angler Guides, as follows: 1. The word "Silex" is registration # 317879 2. The word "Uniqua" is registration # B434648 3. The phrase "Silex Major" is registration # 557604 4. The word "Perfect" (registration # 76989?) To which I can only speculate but based on the other numbers, this can , to me , be the only reasonable reason to stamp such a number to a reel, patent #'s are self explanatory. The Hardy were engineers and knew the importance of protecting everything concerning their products as they had much competition from other big fishing tackle makers. My opinion is the J on the foot is the early foot patent, the # 3 ensured all parts returned together to form the completed reel, "P" was the makers stamp, and the 76989 was the registration # for the word" Perfect".
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WatercolorMan		#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1220 12/30/2008 05:11	Great info on the # we keep seeing. So when you say Hardy reels were registered, where are they registered. Patent office ?
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MFRS		#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 164 12/30/2008 09:42	WatercolorMan wrote: Great info on the # we keep seeing. So when you say Hardy reels were registered, where are they registered. Patent office ? It is not a patent # so it would have to be some government registry office, not sure of anything though; I will look through the books I have for any additional info but am not optomistic about finding more that I will get any more info than what I currently found.
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Bruce Day		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 27 12/31/2008 19:02	"Registered" refers to United Kingdom Trade Marks Registry. While not stated, I assume it refers to a registration of the name HARDY, although it may refer to PERFECT, PRINCESS or other Hardy brands. The notification "Registered" or "Reg. T. M. Office" is required for the name owner to take advantage of the legal benefits registration provides. Last Edited By: Bruce Day 12/31/2008 19:04. Edited 1 time.
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MFRS		#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 457 06/09/2009 22:11	MFRS wrote: steel2afly wrote: Hello all. As it goes "long time lurker" only seldom post. Quick intro. My name is Kevin and I live in a small northern california coastal town. My username should tell you my main interest! Got the classic reel bug a couple of years ago and have to thank all the experts on these pages for all the info and help they have given me, and probably lots of money saved also! Havent really had anything to offer til now. So I picked this reel up last week. Its a Hardy perfect 3 7/8". Ive been trying to educate myself on hardys and have been doing alot of searching to find out more info on this particular reel. So heres what Ive come up with and feel free to correct me and add any info PLEASE! It has a 1912 check, strap over tension screw, white ivorine? handle, nickle silver agate line guard( which has two cracks, bummer) and has hardys pat written on it, Has circular hardys alnwick patent logo on winding plate. The spool has 4 cusps and a locking nut. All parts are marked with a number 3, Now heres where I have a couple of questions. The inside of the winding plate is marked 3 P. The inside of the cage has the marks 3 and below that 7 6989. The 3 and the 7 appear to be slightly smaller case letters than the 6989. The 3s on all parts are matching. Now the foot. Its a smooth brass foot aproximatly 3 3/16' long held in by four screws. Its not dovetailed in and has a letter J stamped on on the base of the foot on the spool side. Lots of stamps on this one! So any ideas on the J or other numbers. Doing my research it seams as though the reel seems to be original parts wise? The J on the foot is kinda throwing me off though. The reel works GREAT! The tension screw was froze up but was able to get it going again no problem, the cracks in the agate are kind of a bummer but oh well. Did a very light cleaning following bulldogs vinegar bath method, allowed it to air dry, gave it a wipe down with a silicone free guncloth and that is the extent of my cleaning. Im pretty happy with this reel and think I may have lucked into a nice one here. So what do ya think? Hope these pictures work! Thanks in advance for any help and info anyone can give me. Kevin I had to resurrect this thread as I came upon new information that I feel explains the numbers stamped on this reel, I know steel2afly and others who are owners of these classic reels will benefit and appreciate their classics , probably, even more. I found that some, if not all, Hardy reels were registered based on the name of the reel. For example, some provenance from Hardy Angler Guides, as follows: 1. The word "Silex" is registration # 317879 2. The word "Uniqua" is registration # B434648 3. The phrase "Silex Major" is registration # 557604 4. The word "Perfect" (registration # 76989?) To which I can only speculate but based on the other numbers, this can , to me , be the only reasonable reason to stamp such a number to a reel, patent #'s are self explanatory. The Hardy were engineers and knew the importance of protecting everything concerning their products as they had much competition from other big fishing tackle makers. My opinion is the J on the foot is the early foot patent, the # 3 ensured all parts returned together to form the completed reel, "P" was the makers stamp, and the 76989 was the registration # for the word" Perfect". Steel2afly, hope you are okay that I brought this thread to life again. I just had to resurrect this thread as there have been so many numbered 1912 checks lately. I have another theory, and I think this is spot-on. The numbers for the 1912 checks are: # 76989 (Above) # 68094 #58402 #57810 I think that these numbers place a date for these reel, the same as the rods have been numbered. There is no list as it is missing, probably, like many of the reel makers on their list. Since Hardy seldom used numbers beyond 100,000 (see rod #'s), it seems Hardy may have discontinued that current numbering system soon after # 76989. If you could add a 1912 check number to this, please do. It would be unrealistic to have a low number in the 1912 check unless it was preceded by a letter, if my theory is correct. Gary Last Edited By: MFRS 06/09/2009 23:11. Edited 1 time.
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pcg		#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2931 06/10/2009 08:42 Admin	Gary, As you know I just acquired a 1912 check Perfect w/ #57810. And Hardys confirmed on Monday of this week that it's a 1911 reel. You write, "I think that these numbers place a date for these reel." I may be dense (no, let's rephrase that: I am dense) but don't see how to turn these 5-digit numbers into dates. Help! Pat
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cdmoore	It's simple enough to cure that foot	#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2823 06/10/2009 09:36 Moderator	Being that the reel is going to be used and not put on a shelf, it's no problem to cure the bend. You will need a short piece of stout, medium diameter that fits the radius of the bottom of the foot (you don't want it too small or the hose clamps will be misshapen when cinched down tight), 4 strong metal hose clamps, a high quality screw driver that fits the hose clamps perfectly, padding (1" wide masking tape works pretty well), and some patience. Make sure your is about 6 inches longer than the reel foot on either side (18 inches total is about perfect) so you can grasp it in your hand or let it sit across your legs with the reel hanging down. Put some tape in the middle of the the length of the reel foot. 2 layers is usually good. Put the reel foot down on the tape and then tape down the unbent side of the foot with a few wraps around both foot and . Masking tape can tear, so don't let go of your reel. Slide one hose clamps down over the foot/ combo, one up near where the foot joins the reel (the thick part of the foot). Then slide the other over the end of the foot, but pointing the other tightening direction (so they are opposing) and not quite to the very end, about 1/4" in from the very end. Clamp these down very tight and keep an eye out for tape tear. If it starts to tear, undo, fix, redo. Might need to add or change tape. And make sure the foot is centered over the . You can't create enough pressure to flatten the radius of the foot bottom, but you can create enough pressure to straighten the foot, i.e. bend it, and possibly the wrong way. Work slowly. Now you're ready to start fixing the bent side. Repeat as for the unbent side, BUT, after you get the first one up snug over the thick part of the bent side, put the second hose clamp (opposing direction) right up next to the one you just put on. Tighten slowly but surely until you see some change. It will be hard to notice and accomplish at this thickness. Work slowly and deliberately. Get a good screwdriver. You don't want to slip or blow out the screw head. Move the hose clamp down one half of its own width and repeat until you get to the end of the foot. Another option is to get enough hose clamps (alternate opposing directions) to completely cover the foot on both sides. I find that the spacing gets cramped, though. If you go that route, be sure to tighten from the thick part down. If you tighten the end of the foot first, where it is thin, you will create a in the foot that is difficult to remove. This method has worked for me without any short or long term damage that I have noticed. If your foot has a twist, that is a different story and I would recommend sending to Bill Archuletta or similar. I've never tried heating the foot first. C "If you finish in 7 days, I'll pay you for 10. If you finish in 10 days, I'll pay you for 7." ~Ballykissangel Last Edited By: cdmoore 06/10/2009 11:53. Edited 1 time.
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cdmoore	"J" on the foot	#17	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2824 06/10/2009 09:39 Moderator	This is great. I've never seen the "J" before. I have seen several reels with "A" or "W", but not yet "J". For this reason, I doubt it has something to do with a foot patent, since my feet look to be perfect matches to yours. I would guess they are batch or maker IDs of some sort. C "If you finish in 7 days, I'll pay you for 10. If you finish in 10 days, I'll pay you for 7." ~Ballykissangel
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MFRS		#18	[url]	[-]
Posts: 458 06/10/2009 10:01	Pat, Hardy's kept a log of their rods by way of a numbering system where, for instance, rods numbered A55753-A66152 were built in 1911. You look at the reel numbers and they could easily have been recorded via the same system. This list, I do believe did existed for the reels but, has not become public, for whatever reason. The recording/numbering of reel seems to have been dropped after the 1912 check and this list could easily have been lost. As the rod list was kept current, it did not get lost, and this could just be a priority decision of the head of that department. Hardy's targeted the decision makers in the world, the rich and famous, I think placing a number to a rod/reel, in itself, makes that item seem unique to owners (there is only one in the world with its number). Also, when someone buys it, it is easily tracked for insurance/ repair/ownership reasons. To match up a generic reel to this rod would seem to down-grade the outfit, but to match a one-of-a-kind reel to a one-of-a-kind rod rod, well, this would be what would get the wealthy/powerful patrons to buy. Gary PS. Pat, you're not dense
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pcg		#19	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2933 06/10/2009 10:35 Admin	Thanks. BTW, the foot on my reel is unstamped. So there is no pattern there, although my Perfect is one of the earliest w/ the 1912 check. Perhaps later reels got the maker's stamp or some other tracking letter.
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bow river		#20	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1453 06/10/2009 11:23	i was doing some research myself as was a 1912 check hardy with the ''D'' stamp on it on that bad site listed awhile ago , and i was hoping to win it , didn't but i found out lots about these so called 1912 check reels from what i have found out is the check or reels we call 1912 was in fact out in some reels befor the year of 1912 , i think the earlest was 1910 , we tend to call them reels 1912 as that was the year that they first showed up in the 1912 catalogs from hardy i now beleave that the reels with the 1912 check in them and with the ''D'' stamp in them was made by or checked over by mr dingley , as he left in 1911 , as for some having the numbers , i think that was for the batches that were made or the year that they were made , i don't beleave the would of stamped each reel with a serial number , just the same number for the year or batch that was made , i also think if you look at some of the hardys with the 1906 check in them , you can tell that some were from same years as the strap over the tensioner is not the same on all them , some have a thicker strap , the early ones i think had the thicker strap and i have seen the same strap on all sizes of that same perfect hardy reel , from the 2 1/2 to the bigger sizes on the brass foot that is bent , it should have 4 screws holding it on , if it was my reel and i was to fix it , i'd soak them screws overnight in liquid wrench and then remove that foot befor trying to straighten it , less chance of maybe breaking that reel , the agate i'd leave it alone , if you can't feel the crack , if you can feel the crack and want it replaced , i know where you can get agates and someone who will swap it out for you , nice reel and i want one of them 1912 check hardys for my collection , i don't have one yet as they seem to fetch such great big money , i'll find one someday , i want a small trout one to use , and the only one i ever had my hands on was super smooth and left me with a wet tasting mouth and wanting one badly Richard Check out my web site for vintage reels & rods , guided float trips on canada's # 1 best trout river http://bowriveradventures.googlepages.com/home
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