Refinished vs Restored

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JimP.fishnbanjosplace	Refinished vs Restored		Lead	[-]
Posts: 21 06/01/2009 19:03	Tags : None If a rod has the varnish removed, ferrules refitted, 1-2 wraps replaced with original colors and revarnished has it been restored or refinished? I know some look at refinished as getting the rod into fishable condition without regard to color of wraps etc. I am not talking about a rod that has been re-done without original or appropriate materials. Thanks for your thoughts. JimP
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fishnbanjo		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6019 06/01/2009 19:08 the Canefather	JimP, Simply put a restoration encompasses the rod be put back in the same manner as which it was when original. If the ferrules were reset there would be a need for the ferrule wraps to be redone, and you state 1-2 wraps replaced using original colors then revarnished keeping the majority of the original wraps intact. Sounds like a loving restoration to me, cheers................ banjo Fly fishing is my Quisisana (the name is Italian for "place where one heals one's self.") "...... SLG Visit my website about Bamboo rods... Fishnbanjo's Place
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tim simbari		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 375 06/01/2009 21:04	Anything above wraps and strip/revarnish is restoration IMHO.
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greg hall		#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 244 06/01/2009 21:34	Jim, The work you describe would be a "correct refinish", but some collectors, not all, might knock the value down a bit for that.
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oneculm		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 569 06/01/2009 22:43	Banjos first sentence is the answer. I do a lot of work with older marble grave markers and to restore means to put it back as it was when original. I guess it depends just how technical someone wants to be. That would mean when a rod is striped the guides/stripper/hook keeper/thread etc. all be the same as came on the rod.The wraps should be treated the same(color preserver or lack of ) and the same final finish both on the cane and the wraps as when new.It can be very difficult to find a lot of the guides and tip tops that were used in the past to make a perfect restoration.The few rods that I do now and then would be called a refinished rod. I will strip them wrap with original or as close to as I can . On all but a few I put modern guides and tip tops on and modern varnish.I would guess the true collector would know in a second if the rod had been truly restored.
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nwdlj	Very interesting question	#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 34 06/02/2009 16:17	this is one where I go back and forth since it seems to me it can be so simple at times and then again an individual question involving the individual specifics of what the work done entails. I agree totally with oneculm's and fishnbanjo's posts but also have to say that for every rule there are exceptions. I know that I have one rod, a Heddon Model 14 represented as original that was redone in the Heddon shop in 1964 because when I took the rod out, saw that the mid was 1 inch short and went "Huh?"... and then looked into the tube, I saw a piece of paper hidden inside...it was an invoice for the work done, noting that the butt and mid had been rewrapped because they had to reset the ferrules since the mid was evidently one of the classic "Heddon Self Shortening Ferrule" that is so frequently discussed here...but anyway, it was done by the Heddon shop with original Heddon thread, original Heddon guides and ferrule, by Heddon workers, a perfect match for original Heddon work...you never would have known why the mid was 1 inch short as it sure looks like it was made that way...so what is this, a refinish, restoration, rework, or a maybe unique example of handmade Heddon work that was done and luckily documented as such? Got me, but I guess where I am going is that its up to both the person doing the work to represent it correctly and the person buying it to judge how he sees it to come to an acceptable representation of the work. I do say that at that point then it becomes what they say as from then on, it can be hard to figure this stuff out, everyone's stories being different. I know that I have received a rod that to me at least when received, appeared to have been dipped with new varnish, that the seller swears as original, never touched. I would have not believed him except that two guides had been broken off in shipping (the reason why I was talking to him) and when looking at the finish and thread underneath the broken wraps, were definitely original...so I now agree with the representation as original varnish...I guess that its a caveat emptor and deal with people you trust, someone like oneculm, if you must have a proper representation in order to pull the trigger on a rod...that's my 2 cents worth...dj
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DrakeBob		#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1340 06/03/2009 14:15 Formerly Drake	I also agree that Banjo and Dave (oneculm) have stated things correctly. And clearly the expectations set between the restorer/refinisher and the buyer are important. Nevertheless, the word "restore" has a very specific meaning in the English language. The issue occurs in Jim's sentence: "I am not talking about a rod that has been re-done without original or appropriate materials." With "original materials" there should be no debate. But, what is "appropriate?" That's where we begin to split hairs (but, hey, that's what we get paid to do around here). Is it "appropriate" to replace, specifically, Granger green wraps with some shade of green? I believe it's "appropriate" at some level because "appropriate" means suitable for the purpose, but I wouldn't call it a "restoration." IMHO, the number of rods that have been truly restored is very small in comparison to the number of rods that have been refinished. Piscator Non Solum Piscatur
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greg hall		#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 245 06/03/2009 15:44	I've been told that back in the days when fishing seasons were not year round that it was not uncommon for the sports to send their rods to the maker's shops for a little tune up or some repairs during the off season. So a rod repaired by Heddon or Granger or Payne or Leonard or...would no doubt qualify to most standards as a properly restored rod. I'm a little curious as to why Heddon would reset a ferrule on a short mid rather than replace the section given that they must have had plenty of inventory. I agree with D'Bob that most, not all, "restorations" these days probably qualify as refinishing simply because quite often the original threads are quite rare in some cases and very few people are likely to have any or even know for certain the exact brand and color of the original thread.
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fishbum		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 292 06/03/2009 16:12	I keep it simple. I tell my customers that I will repair or refurbish their rod to as close to original as I possibly can. However, if they are looking for a restoration they will have to look elsewhere. I don't do restorations because of the implication that the rod would be returned to a condition like new and original. Same guides, thread, ferrules, cork, reelseat and on and on it goes. I don't do restorations, I do repairs, period. fishbum
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