Question on ferrules and rod tips that twist

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Eperous	Question on ferrules and rod tips that twist		Lead	[-]
Posts: 71 07/24/2009 17:58	Tags : None I have a question that involves several different cane rods I use, built by different bamboo rod makers. All of these rods have tight ferrules that pop; one is so tight that I need use home-made grippers, made from shelf lining material, to separate the male and female ferrule when I'm done fishing. I believe this problem is all me and looking for help to diagnose it. I notice that over a period of time while fishing, on some cane rods, the tip twists slightly to the left from center. Usually I separate the tip and the butt resetting both pieces of bamboo. However, I am very curious what might cause this problem so I can stop doing whatever it is I'm doing. I am a right hand caster, if that matters at all. In thinking about this problem I foresee four possible causes: (1) my casting stroke, (2) playing trout, (3) retrieving flies and/or (4) closely related perhaps, the angle/way I hold/fish the rod. Normally this problem occurs when I'm fishing medium to larger size rivers, casting flies size 12 and larger flies - sometimes streamers and wets, and catching trout anywhere from 10" to 14" as a norm, with some larger. Since I do not experience this problem when I'm fishing headwater brook trout streams catching wild 5"-9" brookies using #14-16 dry flies, I doubt the cause is item #1. I'm really trying to focus on my on-stream efforts to determine a cause(s), any ideas and/or suggestions? Thanks. Ed
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Richard	Tip twist	#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 9 07/24/2009 18:26	Hello Ed, List, I too have have the same problem when trying to power cast to those hard to reach trout on big rivers and lakes. As a matter of fact I have the same problem with both bamboo and graphite rods. All ferrules on the rods are tight so I believe it must be my casting form/bad habits. Can old dogs learn new tricks and correct bad habits from years ago? I hope so... -Richard
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Southbranch		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 448 07/24/2009 20:01	I've had the same experience. I think that the flexing and twisting forces that pass through the ferrules during casting eventually cause the tip to rotate, since friction is all that holds the male and female ferrules together. It happens at different rates with different rods, and it happens faster with looser ferrules and harder casting. I don't think there is any cure for it, and I don't worry about it. I just check the alignment from time to time and reposition the tip section as necessary.
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cdmoore	My experience: it is from casting...	#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2939 07/24/2009 20:48 Moderator	Here are my own observations: --I am a decent caster with both arms. --I tend to naturally cast the way I used to pitch baseballs--with about a 3/4 side-arm motion. More so with my right arm, less so with my left arm. --Over the course of a couple of hours of fishing, most of my rods get a tip twist where the tip has rotated inside the female ferrule. --When I cast right armed, this twist is clockwise sighting down the rod tip pointing away from me. It is the opposite using the same exact rod with my left arm. --The more overhead I cast, the less it happens. Switching casting arms periodically seems to negate this twisting. --The more power I exert casting (distance, line weight, fly weight, etc.) , the more it happens. --The looser the ferrules, the faster it happens. Hope this helps and remember not to twist the ferrule back into place...remove and reset straight. Chris "If you finish in 7 days, I'll pay you for 10. If you finish in 10 days, I'll pay you for 7." ~Ballykissangel Last Edited By: cdmoore 07/25/2009 14:09. Edited 1 time.
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DRhodes	Tip Twist	#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 17 07/25/2009 06:46	Ed, This happens to me frequently, especially when I fish larger waters. The way I see it, it is the way I cast. When I began fishing, it was in the mountain streams choked full of rhododendron. Most of my cast were short and parallel with the water...certainly not overhead. Even on larger waters, my casts are in the 3/4 arm slot or lower. I also wonder if throwing beaded nymphs with the extra weight had something to do with it. I've often wondered...so thanks for asking! D
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Eperous		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 73 07/25/2009 08:12	Hey CD and everyone else, Thanks for the feedback and food for thought.... the fourth item I was honing in on was the angle of my hand that I hold the rod with, I just didn't go up the rod far enough.... I also tend to cast 3/4 arm - or roughly 2 o'clock position if true vertical is high noon; or like I was throwing a baseball.... I have been trying to hold my rod in vertical position just to see what happen happen, and I do believe less twist occurs..... additionally, when I fish wet flies and/or streamers, I tend to strip fly line back into me holding the rod in the same position also, and I thought the surface tension of the water on line dragging through it also put a force on the rod tip..... as I mentioned, when fishing close in, with smaller dry flies - I don't see this problem.... my natural casting position is 3/4 arm as that's my comfort zone after almost fifty years of fly fishing, so I doubt that will change.... odd though, I don't recall having this occur when I fished graphite rods a few years ago... Thanks again folks for the feedback and food for thought... Ed
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Tom Smithwick	twisting sections	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 517 07/25/2009 12:00	I believe the problem is caused by twisting the wrist when casting. There is an utterly simple way to address the problem. Believe it or not, just change your stance. If you are right handed, cast with your right foot in front of you. Stand in front of a mirror, and mimic a casting motion, first with your left foot in front, and then with the right foot in front. You will see that it is all too easy to roll your wrist with the open stance, and actually difficult with the closed stance. You probably have a muscle memory for the wrist roll. If you practice casting with the closed stance, you will eventually replace it with a memory of the straight tracking wrist, then you can use any stance you want. This will also increase accuracy, and maybe distance, too, depending on how much your wrist is turning.
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cdmoore	Good point, Tom	#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2941 07/25/2009 14:12 Moderator	Wrist roll can often be evidences by your line hooking at the end of a cast in the direction opposite the arm you are casting with. Casting righty? Line hooks to the left. C "If you finish in 7 days, I'll pay you for 10. If you finish in 10 days, I'll pay you for 7." ~Ballykissangel
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winston59		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 145 07/25/2009 22:42	I agree with what has been stated and I think Chris has summed it up nicely. I first experienced this while fishing on a windy day with my 8 foot South Bend rod using a 6wt line. I really needed to cast with tight loops and the rod cast beautifully. I saw the tip was off enough to say "what?" I just figured it was the wind and really working rod and line to get the proper length cast. Of course due to the wind I was really working the side arm cast to keep the line lower to the water.
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afgantrout		#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 624 07/26/2009 17:14	What a useful thread! I haven't been aware of having this problem in the past but it's occurring with my latest rod. I shall take these tips to heart and work on them. Thanks, Mr. Smithwick! # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Petri heil! Kindly take a look at my angling art (and classic ephemera) www.michaelsimonanglingart.com
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Eperous		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 75 07/27/2009 10:24	Tom, Thanks.... I'll try to be more aware of this next time I fish..... Saturday I fished the upper Neversink here in the Catskills for brook trout, much easier to fool than on your PA Big Spring Creek.... let me know if you want the details... Ed
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Question on ferrules and rod tips that twist

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